Alt-BEAM Archive
Message #10655
To: beam@sgiblab.sgi.com
From: "FCO Enr." fco@total.net
Date: Tue, 22 Feb 2000 14:39:45 -0500
Subject: [alt-beam] Re: Steering an Aquabot and giving it a purpose.
greetings,
I think your aquabot idea is great. I always wanted to make a
robot that could brave the deeps and explore.
You could use Nitinol (muscle wire -- www.robotstore.com)
to move the tail to dive or surface.
I thought about this quite abit and here are a few things that
make me think that if an aquabot will be made it will be quite a complex
beast.
A- why waste hard earned power to dive when you can sink?
B- why waste hard earned power to float back up to surface?
Answer: Use compressed air with a tiny regulator which when
the bot is out of power, will let a burst of air into the ballast tanks
and cause the bot to float to the surface. A co2 cartridge like the
ones for pellet guns could have well over 400 such low PSI charges.
Problem: I hate depending on something the bot can't survive without.
the only viable solution is to make the bot able to compress small
amounts of air before it dives (by ridding the ballast tanks of the=
last
air blast).
C- Navigation. How to make the bot navigate underwater to avoid
just blindly roaming about and maybe give it a trajectory or just a
return goal. (in ocean exploration.. how not to drift when recharging
on surface?).
D- Making sure it will always surface solar panels up :)
Andy
fco@total.net
*********** REPLY SEPARATOR ***********
On 22/02/00, at 9:00 AM, Richard Caudle wrote:
>Hey!
>
>Just thought of a way to make my manta 'dive'. Mantas have a tail, right?
>Make the tail so that it can become rigid so that it curves down to dive=
and
>curves up to surface! May be a bit difficult from a mechanical=
standpoint.
>Could be done with a flexible tube and a string attached through the=
inside
>to the top and bottom of the end. The only thing is pulling the string.
>
>More cranial victuals!
>
>Richard
10656 Tue, 22 Feb 2000 14:38:11 EST [alt-beam] Ic chips beam@sgiblab.sgi.com BowfinGar1@aol.com I am working on a walker but can't find the 74HC245's
that I need for the master-slave setup. I was woundering,
Could I use any ten pin DIP IC chip for the setup or does it to be
a 74HC245 for it to work?
thanks
Mark
10657 Tue, 22 Feb 2000 12:13:16 -0800 [alt-beam] Re: Steering an Aquabot and giving it a purpose. beam@sgiblab.sgi.com Bruce Robinson Sathe Dilip wrote:
>
>> JVernonM@aol.com wrote:
>> ... they will sink like a rock at colder temps ...
>
> I think it should be the other way around wrt temperature.
> Density of water increases with falling temperature ...
Yup. Galileo's thermometer. Sealed & weighted glass spheres in an
enclosed column of water, each one with a slightly different density.
The spheres are marked with the temperature at which they float.
To give you an idea of the sensitivity, one of these thermometers made
with modern equipment has an accuracy of 0.2 degrees C. In other words,
this kind of temperature change makes the difference between floating
and sinking. (and yes, you can still buy them.)
This means if you make your aquabot barely bouyant at the surface, it
will need more thrust to push it down in colder water. Usually water
gets colder at greater depths, so you'll never lose your aquabot.
However, it's possible to reverse the temperature gradient in a body of
water. If a body of still water is covered with a layer of water
containing dissolved minerals, you could get much warmer water at lower
depths. Not common in nature, but one should always be prepared:)
Bruce
10658 Tue, 22 Feb 2000 12:13:09 -0800 [alt-beam] Re: Robotic philosophy (Tendency toward miniaturization) beam@sgiblab.sgi.com Bruce Robinson JVernonM@aol.com wrote:
>
> ... Are we more than the sum of our parts? Or, can a machine be
> built that can reproduce every facet of what it is to be alive?
Read "The Society of Mind", Marvin Minsky, Simon & Schuster, 1985, ISBN
0-671-60740-5.
> ... I wonder at times if a robot will someday, in the far future,
> write a note to a list asking whether it is a good idea to create
> a biological lifeform that emulates mechanical life :).
And, if you can get your hand on it, "Farewell to the Master", Harry
Bates, found in "Famous Science-fiction Stories", ed. Raymond J. Healy
and J. Francis McComas, Random House, 1946, 1957.
Thomas Pilgaard wrote:
> ... We tend to create something to which we eventually find a use....
A concept defined by Michael Hammer as a "rhetorical answer". We find
the answer to a question, without knowing which question we are
answering. Then we have to figure out what question we should have
asked.
JVernonM@aol.com wrote:
>
> ... technology in and of itself has it's roots in violence. The
> first use of technology was simple weapons and tools to simplify
> hunting and killing. Some of our greatest advancements come from
> the military applications.
Sadly true. I suspect this is due to a more fundamental drive to control
our personal environments. Now if only we could learn to UNDERSTAND our
personal environments before trying to control them ...
Wyzrd1 wrote:
>
> ... Robotics may not change human nature - we always have been and
> probably always will be a bunch of violent buttheads at heart-
> but it MAY (if we play our cards right) make our most dangerous
> forms of violence into something that just costs money and bots,
> not lives.
Not until you find a cure for testosterone poisoning :)
> Dane Gardner wrote:
>
> ... You can't honestly believe that genetic material makes one
> act a certain way.
Now, now. Don't go telling people what they can and can't believe :)
We are all genetically "wired" to some extent, in that each of us is
predisposed to learn and communicate in a certain manner. This
influences, but doesn't determine, our personalities. Other genetic
factors (e.g. hormone levels) influence the degree to which we respond
to a certain stimulus.
> You are taught whether intentionally or unintentionally whatever
> it is that make you you, throughout your lifetime.
Not quite. A common fallacy, promoted by the teaching profession. We
LEARN whatever it is that makes us what we are. Teaching is merely an
attempt to influence what we learn.
> Modern American psychology upholds this belief.
Interesting. A great deal of "modern american psychology" is
contradictory. You just don't get to hear too much from those who stray
from the "mainstream" beliefs. Thus it has always been.
Regards,
Bruce
10659 Tue, 22 Feb 2000 12:12:18 -0800 [alt-beam] Re: BEAM: Tendency toward miniaturization beam@sgiblab.sgi.com Bruce Robinson Timothy Flytch wrote:
>
> ... I can also see a deferent possible future, or at least a
> faction... That is shoe box sized robots ...
That is certainly a viable option. When you use the physical scaling
method, you'll find that there is a somewhat loose range of sizes that
we amateur BEAMers can work within. There's a little room to scale up,
and quite a bit of room to scale down.
Personally, I'm working toward the upward size, but in increments. My
three-motor walker (yes, progress is happening) will fit inside a
shoebox, but you won't get two of them in there.
> ... small enough to stay out of your way but big enough to do
> real yard work ...
You, know, there's something I've always wondered about. From time to
time an experienced BEAMer will ask, "So, what next? Is this all there
is?" No one seems to want to take on the task of building a robot that
will detect (and avoid) people!
Granted, actual "avoiding" may not be easy for a slow-moving robot, but
it could at least avoid getting stepped on. Sense an approaching human
(or any large mammal) and sound an alarm. Or if it's dark, flash a
strobe.
> to walk over grass you need a bot that can take 3-5 inch steps
> and be big enough to be able to pick up a leaf and do something
> with it... Tall enough to reach the tops of the grass with enough
> span so as to be stable so that as it cuts, the cuts are all at
> the same relative height...
A few people have done some work. I saw a link (since lost, I'm afraid)
to a Lego-based hovercraft style device that used a spinning razor blade
to cut the grass. You DEFINITELY want mammal detecting capabilities if
you're going to turn one of these loose.
Steve Bolt has also done some preliminary work on this, although I don't
think there's anything about it on his web site.
> Big enough to sweep the kitchen but small enough to fit under the
> counters where it seeks refuge when you enter...
Seeking refuge. See above.
> Or to go over your socks you left on the bedroom floor...
WHAT socks on the bedroom floor? Not in THIS house :)
Regards,
Bruce
10660 Tue, 22 Feb 2000 12:10:16 -0800 [alt-beam] Re: BEAM: Tendency toward miniaturization "Les Davis"
content-transfer-encoding: quoted-printable
Geez Jim, I all cheered up now! LOL
I just had an image of a world populated by inert automobiles because the=
ir =
creators asphyxiated on the exhaust fumes. What would big headed gray ali=
ens =
think upon setting foot on such a world :)?
See ya,
Jim
http://www.geocities.com/SoHo/Exhibit/8281/beamart.html
ICQ# 55657870
content-transfer-encoding: quoted-printable
>
x; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; PADDING-RIGHT: 0px">I =
just had an image of a world populated by inert automobiles because their=
=
creators asphyxiated on the exhaust fumes. What would big headed gray=
=
aliens
think upon setting foot on such a world :)?
See =
ya,
Jim
href=3D"http://w=">http://www.geocities.com/SoHo/Exhibit/8281/beamart.html">http://w=
ww.geocities.com/SoHo/Exhibit/8281/beamart.html
ICQ# =
55657870
Home