Alt-BEAM Archive
Message #05978
To: beam@sgiblab.sgi.com
From: Justin jaf60@student.canterbury.ac.nz
Date: Mon, 06 Sep 1999 04:25:13 +1200
Subject: [alt-beam] Re: DIfferent approach to locomotion
> about the parasite/pick-up-and-take-it bot.. you could power it with
> one of those kinetic watch mechanisms.. it would 'feed' off of it's
> host's movement..
I've taken apart a movement-powered watch, the mechanism was simple
enough - a weight attached to a central axis, so that as you move the
weight moves. Thing is, it was not a new watch, and it was a while ago,
so I can't actually remember if it electric or spring powered. A spring
would make more sense - the weight moved easily, indicating it wasn't
geared up to drive a dynamo, but perhaps geared down to wind a spring -
however I seem to recall that I thought it electric at the time.
So, a question - how to modern kinetic watches generate their power? I
suspect a mechanism like the one I describe, but it would be good to
know. Unfortunately, we're talking about absolutely miniscule amounts of
energy (I'm personally inclined to think uselessly small amounts :), but
on the other hand, there would be a lot of motion to be harnessed if,
say, the bot was an aquavore that floated on choppy water - a more
constant source of energy than the sun, even if vastly more feeble.
Another question - to build a crude and simple kinetic power source (ie
grab a motor and attach a stick with a weight on the end of it, such
that any tilt of the motor results in the weight swinging around), we
have the problem of getting DC from the AC of the "dynamo" - AC because
the weight can swing both ways. The normal way to do this is a four
diode bridge. Trouble is, the 0.7V diode cost is a bit hit on what is
being generated. I'm thinking that some kind of gearing up is going to
be needed just to get a useful voltage to begin with, let alone once the
diodes are connected.
For these reasons, I get the impression that this is the wrong tree to
be barking up. Perhaps a low-current watch mechanism can get away with
using it, but perhaps they use a better way. Anyone know?
Which reminds me - Many years ago I made a wind meter by adding a
propellor to the shaft of a motor (no gearing) and wiring the motor to a
meter. Just two components, which by chance resulted in a good range
accross the meter depending on the wind speed. Now I'm thinking that
adding a gear box could have resulted in some genuine power generation
(the prop was nearly two feet long - easily providing enough torque to
drive a big gearbox). Hmmm, what BEAMish possibilities could wind power
aid?
(None spring immediately to mind... :-)
5979 Mon, 06 Sep 1999 01:06:28 GMT [alt-beam] legitimacy of HuFO beam@sgiblab.sgi.com "Dennison Bertram" There's been much debate recently, on the valitidty of HuFo's form of
motion. I wouldn't be so quick to write the experiment in locomotion off.
While I gather the motion isn't achived in quite the way perhaps people
assume it is, I'm relatively sure that there are mechanisms which perhaps
controll a form of directional motion.
Why do I say this? Well, although Chiu hasn't posted the video of my contest
entry yet (where is he anyway?) I too entered an vehicle that moved based on
rotary motion perpendicular to the plane of motion. However I tend to belive
that I have refined the motion considerably more than HuFO. The claim that
Hufo work's in a vacume, I am skeptical of. I tend more to belive that the
devices contact with the ground at certian point is thus that a somewhat net
motion is achived through the interaction of friction and the robot. My
robot works on this principle. But shifting the weight, considerablly, I'm
able to achive a net forward motion. (A very well controlled forward motion
I might add. The effects are much easyer to see than that of HuFo's.) I
wouldn't difinitively write off centripetal force, but those of you
discussing it should more carefully consider what your actually talking
about. And pick up a textbook. Those who talk about the acceleration
outwards are wrong. It's actually and acceleration IN, twards the center of
the object. And at any particular time, the tangent, or moment of motion is
tangential to the circle of motion. So I think a few people have got their
physics wrong. I'd gather the motion of HuFO has more to deal with the
physical properties of the surface and the vehicle. Still, if it works, it
works.
PS don't reply to this address. I'll never get it.
Dennison
______________________________________________________
5980 Mon, 6 Sep 1999 17:11:59 EDT [alt-beam] Re: CD-ROM read-head feet beam@sgiblab.sgi.com Gadagada@aol.com In a message dated 99-09-06 13:23:37 EDT, jaf60@student.canterbury.ac.nz
writes:
<< Which reminds me - as far as I know, the light from CD-ROM drive laser
diodes is invisible, but this doesn't sit well with the explicit laser
warnings on the case and instructions not to look at the beam. Can
anyone enlighten me as to what the story is? >>
Remember, just because we can't see the light doesn't mean it isn't there.
It's just light that is out of the range of human sight, but it still can
potentially damage the retina.
Gary
5981 Mon, 6 Sep 1999 22:46:48 +0100 [alt-beam] Re: newcomer 4 neuron microicore feedback ?? alt-beam@eGroups.com James G Watt In article , James G Watt
writes
>I've built myself a 4 neuron microcore I was
>under the impression that the timing was supposed to vary depending on
>the load on the motors? my circuit
>appears to run as regular as a metronome no matter what load is attached
>to it?
I built the thing following the instructions here:
http://www.xs4all.nl/~vsim/amiller/microcore.html
--
James G Watt
http://www.kinetic-arts.demon.co.uk
Part of the Video Arcade Game Collectors WebRing.
You are in a maze of twisty little passages, all alike.
5982 Mon, 6 Sep 1999 17:53:07 EDT [alt-beam] Re: CD-ROM read-head feet beam@sgiblab.sgi.com Bumper314@aol.com In a message dated 9/6/99 10:23:37 AM Pacific Daylight Time,
jaf60@student.canterbury.ac.nz writes:
> This one has _got_ to have come up before, but it's new to me:
> I needed some tiny screws, and found some in the reading head of an old
> CD-ROM I had pulled to bits. Upon getting my screws, the head fell to
> bits . I started fiddling with the bits, and hooked them up with
> power.
> As you probably know, in addition to the motors, the lense's position is
> fine-tuned with coils and magnets. Playing with these, I found the head
> had quite a lot of freedom of movement, and quite a lot of grunt (very
> strong magnets, very fine wire, many winds). It can move up, down, left
> and right. IOW, hook it up to a microcore and you have a one-footed
> walker that can AFAICS do anything a two motor walker can. Hook it up to
> something with more states and it can do more (such as turn left or
> right). Even running the coils off a tiny 470uF cap was enough for them
> to twitch their metal casing off the ground. Use a battery and they
> practically leap...
> I took apart another head, from a different brand, and this one moved
> up, down, pivot left, pivot right - even more useful.
>
> I suspect, however, the easiest application is for BEAMish art - take
> the butterfly (or whatever) on a stick, put the stick on the head
> arrangement, and connect a standard audio plug to the coils (left
> channel to one coil set, right channel the other), plug it into your amp
> and watch the butterfly conduct an orchestra in stereo :-)
> (I suspect the butterfly will spend most of its time conducting the
> drums and ignoring the strings, but that's butterflies for you... :)
>
> Stick an LED on the end of the stick instead, or a laser diode, and have
> an annoying "light show" on the roof.
>
> Which reminds me - as far as I know, the light from CD-ROM drive laser
> diodes is invisible, but this doesn't sit well with the explicit laser
> warnings on the case and instructions not to look at the beam. Can
> anyone enlighten me as to what the story is?
>
ive been working on a robot just like that...but since i cant build its kinda
hard =)
steve
5983 Mon, 06 Sep 1999 21:23:00 -0500 [alt-beam] Re: alright....im out beam@sgiblab.sgi.com Richard Piotter What are you asking for the BG Micro and 1:40 motors, as well as the ICs
(all), and maybe some trim pots, photodiodes, and transistors.
It must realy suck to go through such a stretch off poor luck. I
remember back last time, so it's not like you havn't tried. Are you
planing on trying some microcontrolelr based bots. or some other hobby
all together? I wish you luck! I got some money in, so if I do buy
stuff, I'll pay a far price. I know what some of that stuff costs. I
spent over $600 on various motors. They get expensive! I know what it's
like to build dead bots. I have only one solar bot that works properly.
2 are patheticly intermittent, and one is terrible. I havn't worried
myself with solar bots, expect for a Photopopper I got for free. That
was easy. I just don't seem to have much luck with the solar bots.
That's why I stick to walkers and otehr battery powerd bots. I guess as
long as you find something you like, then that's good.
Bumper314@aol.com wrote:
>
> well its been about 6 months since ive been able to make a bot, and i still
> just cant build...so im going to start selling some stuff...sigh...quick list
> of stuff i have, contact me with a fair price if you are interested
> (privately).
> Solar cells, all 4 solarbotics sizes
> gear motors, bg micro, 40:1 ratio and 1024:1 ratio escaps, even an OTU =)
> ICs...all you need, 244s, 245s, 240s, 14s, 139s, 157s
> caps, many many caps...
> resistors...same here...all the good beam values
> photodiodes, LEDs, 1381s, (3906 and 3904s in the 100s), trim pots, plenty of
> walkman motors.....
> all this crap together cost me about $3000....i tried really hard to make a
> come back but i just dont have it in me...dont konw why, oh well
>
> steve
--
Richard Piotter
richfile@rconnect.com
The Richfiles Robotics & TI web page:
http://richfiles.calc.org
For the BEAM Robotics list:
BEAM Robotics Tek FAQ
http://people.ne.mediaone.net/bushbo/beam/FAQ.html
5984 Mon, 06 Sep 1999 22:16:58 -0500 [alt-beam] Re: CD-ROM read-head feet beam@sgiblab.sgi.com Richard Piotter Just cause you can't see an intense light doesn't mean it can't hurt
you. if you stare at UV light, it'll damave your eyes. if you stare at
an intense IR BEAM, it too will damage your eyes, just as visible light will.
Justin wrote:
>
> This one has _got_ to have come up before, but it's new to me:
> I needed some tiny screws, and found some in the reading head of an old
> CD-ROM I had pulled to bits. Upon getting my screws, the head fell to
> bits . I started fiddling with the bits, and hooked them up with
> power.
> As you probably know, in addition to the motors, the lense's position is
> fine-tuned with coils and magnets. Playing with these, I found the head
> had quite a lot of freedom of movement, and quite a lot of grunt (very
> strong magnets, very fine wire, many winds). It can move up, down, left
> and right. IOW, hook it up to a microcore and you have a one-footed
> walker that can AFAICS do anything a two motor walker can. Hook it up to
> something with more states and it can do more (such as turn left or
> right). Even running the coils off a tiny 470uF cap was enough for them
> to twitch their metal casing off the ground. Use a battery and they
> practically leap...
> I took apart another head, from a different brand, and this one moved
> up, down, pivot left, pivot right - even more useful.
>
> I suspect, however, the easiest application is for BEAMish art - take
> the butterfly (or whatever) on a stick, put the stick on the head
> arrangement, and connect a standard audio plug to the coils (left
> channel to one coil set, right channel the other), plug it into your amp
> and watch the butterfly conduct an orchestra in stereo :-)
> (I suspect the butterfly will spend most of its time conducting the
> drums and ignoring the strings, but that's butterflies for you... :)
>
> Stick an LED on the end of the stick instead, or a laser diode, and have
> an annoying "light show" on the roof.
>
> Which reminds me - as far as I know, the light from CD-ROM drive laser
> diodes is invisible, but this doesn't sit well with the explicit laser
> warnings on the case and instructions not to look at the beam. Can
> anyone enlighten me as to what the story is?
--
Richard Piotter
richfile@rconnect.com
The Richfiles Robotics & TI web page:
http://richfiles.calc.org
For the BEAM Robotics list:
BEAM Robotics Tek FAQ
http://people.ne.mediaone.net/bushbo/beam/FAQ.html
5985 Tue, 07 Sep 1999 10:14:10 +0200 [alt-beam] MAXIM chip for SE beam@sgiblab.sgi.com Evaristo Westplate Hi,
I just received the MAXIM analog design guide and came across the "MAXIM965
- MAX970 micro power, ultra-low-voltage comparators" with internal
reference. Available as single comparator in a chip or up to 4 comparators
in a chip. They operate from +1.6 - 5.5 volts which make them very useful
for solar engines. The MAX966 and MAX970 even operate at 1 volt. Now we can
finally build the SE which can monitor the charge current and trigger when
it drops below a certain threshold. Datasheets can be downloaded at
http://www.maxim-ic.com/Datasheets.htm
Only drawback is that the components
are available in small packages (SO and uMAX). I will try the MAX969. It
has 4 comparators and a reference voltage. When I have created something
useful I will let you now.
See'ya
Evaristo
Gizmo homepage: http://www.crosswinds.net/~evaristo
Home