Alt-BEAM Archive
Message #00417
To: TurtleTek@aol.com, beam@corp.sgi.com
From: "Zulu 35" zulu35@singnet.com.sg
Date: Mon, 15 Feb 1999 14:15:41 +0800
Subject: [alt-beam] Re: question
huh?? and i always regarded the cybug as a BEAM robot... heheehe well guess
i'm wrong... or am i?
----------
> From: TurtleTek@aol.com
> To: beam@corp.sgi.com
> Subject: Re: question
> Date: Monday, February 15, 1999 12:54 PM
>
> Greetings List,
>
> After reading the "question" thread (which I find very interesting, more
on
> that later), I've noticed many mentions of the "cybug". Most of these
> mentions have been comparing the cybug to the photovore. Sort of
"conventional
> robots vs BEAM". Well, as I see it, isn't the cybug BEAM? The meaning
of
> BEAM is so very vague and I don't think it's much of a stretch to include
the
> cybug under BEAM. Why not?
> It's not solar powered? So what, most walkers aren't.
> "But walkers have nv nets", you say. Big deal.
> "Cybugs aren't self-sufficiant". Neither are walkers, they need their
cell
> charged every now and then.
>
> Cybugs don't use programming or a CPU. They can "feed" themselves. So,
unless
> the requirements for being BEAM are as follows:
> Must be solar powered, if not then must use nv net.
> Then we can just go ahead and slap a BEAM lable on the cybug too, no? Any
> thoughts on this are welcome.
>
> And now, about the "question" thread...
>
> >> What do you mean by REAL WORLD?
> > mean real robots. Autonomous, seemingly sentiant, and possessing the
ability
> >to interact with humans on a level that produces meaningful
relationships.
>
> *chokes on drink, spitting it out all over the monitor* What?! Perhaps
the
> reason you find so many faults in BEAM is that you don't quite grasp the
idea.
> We're not out to make a R2D2 or Lt. Data, nor do we expect to in the near
> future (or distant future). Right about now we have robots that are like
> protists and far from even being like any form of animal with a brain,
let
> alone things even seeming like humans. This isn't a huge goverment funded
> robotics (AI) project such as Cog or Cyc, BEAM is a hobby based on the
idea
> that robots should be autonomous and don't have to be complex. Just a
hobby.
> Either I missed something or you haven't quite done your homework on
BEAM.
> Neither one of those options are ones I find likely. I just find myself
saying
> to myself "eh..what is this guy thinking?"
>
> >This can be construction, hazardous employment, servitude,
entertainment,
> >pets, household maintenance, this is limited only by your imagination.
>
> BEAM robots are currently being used for entertainment and pets. The only
> other thing I can imagine them doing is exploring. Hazardous employment,
> servitude, maintenance, all not BEAM. Well...maybe maintenance (Hey,
maybe I
> should strap a toothbrush onto ProtoBot....hmm 8)
>
> >Perhaps this is my own interpratation.
>
> I guess so. Everyone has their own interpretation but I must say I find
yours
> a little far fetched..
>
> >I basicly believe we (builders) are attracted
> >to the idea of human created artificial life.
>
> That's why many of us got into BEAM, the idea of artifical life.
>
> >Being alive entails much more
> >than being able to walk over sand dunes.
>
> Yeah..being alive entails the following:
> 1)Being composed of cells. (our bots will never meet this...I don't even
agree
> with this requirement of life.)
> 2)Organization of self
> 3) Energy use
> 4)Response to environment
> 5) Growth (again..I don't think we'll ever build a growing bot)
> 6) Reproduction (bots don't reproduce on their own but I see this as a
reality
> in the future...)
> 7) Adaptation (adaptations only happen through reproduction)
>
> Hmm..I don't see "Human interaction" or "Sentience" up there.. I do,
however,
> see response to environment. Before we get into a robot that
communicates
> with us we have to have it at least be able to "walk on sand dunes"!
Again,
> this is a basic concept of BEAM. Another BEAM fundemental is the idea
that we
> can build robots out of stuff we find and/or can get easly. BEAM is not a
kit-
> based hobby. That seems to be another thing you fail to grasp.
>
> I don't want to seem too challenging but I just had to say something.
Most of
> the things you (Jim) say make sense, all except what I mentioned above.
>
>
> On to other topics.
>
> About my website. Yep, looks like its going to be another week before I
open
> it. Sorry guys, I just want to make it good from the beginning. So expect
it
> out next saturday.
>
> -TurtleTek
> "Yu, shall I tell you what knowledge is? When you know a thing,
> say that you know it. When you do not know a thing, admit you
> do not know it. This is knowledge."
> - K'ung-fu Tzu (Confucius)
>
>
>
>
>
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